Dagon's physical appearance

JFCC · Post by **JFCC** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 4:59 pm

Seeing SOTA toys' depiction of Dagon (you can see it here) has made me wonder where the traditional conception of Dagon as an especially large Deep One comes from...is that a Derleth (or Chaosium) addition, or does HPL hint it somewhere?

Post by **Aleister** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 6:58 pm

That is a good question. I do not remember much about his appearance being given in the actual story 'Dagon', but I need to check again.

It is easy to forget which visual stuff comes from actual stories, and which has just been the common view for a long time

nortonew · Post by **nortonew** » Thu Feb 24, 2005 7:34 pm

After doing some research on Dagon, I believe he should be something of a cross between a human, fish, and a bull. There are quite a few legends that seem to be related to Dagon that describe a giant bull that lives in the sea.

One interesting example of this is the Greek legend of Cadmus. Cadmus was a member of the Phoenician royal family. His sister was kidnapped by a giant bull that took her into the sea.

Cadmus then went searching for her but finally gave up and settled down in Greece. He does some stuff there like teach the Greeks how to read and write. At the end of the story, he and his wife change into 'serpent' people.

The really interesting thing about him changing into a part-human/part-serpent is that the Phoenician royal family claimed to be descendants of Dagon. Thus, like the people in the Innsmouth story, his Dagon-tainted blood caused him to change into a non-human creature. I can't help but think that if he was turning into a Deep One type creature, it could easily be mistaken for turning into a serpent.

I can't help but wonder if Lovecraft got his idea from legends like this. There are actually quite a few legends like this. It kind of makes me wonder if there is something behind it all.

The Ziggurat · Post by **The Ziggurat** » Fri Feb 25, 2005 2:16 am

im not sure about stories and descriptions but i do know that i'll definitly be buying these when they become available!!!!

\m/\m/

The Huntsville Horror · Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:25 pm

Seconded; that Dagon is easily the coolest figure I've ever seen.

Drago · Post by **Drago** » Wed Mar 09, 2005 6:50 am

Where could i get them? and when do they come out?

Eidolon · Post by **Eidolon** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 5:48 pm

I always assumed Dagon to look more like Tsathoggua, actually: huge, squat, toadlike, but scaly and with massive arms, and eyes blacker than the depths. I wouldn't be surprised if Derleth was responsible, but who knows. The typical Babylonian depiction was as a merman-esque creature.

Jesus Prime · Post by **Jesus Prime** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 6:50 pm

I pictured some sort of dinosaurish thing. Stocky and muscular, but with a definate reptillian look. I know that's completely against the whole fish thing, but that's what appeared in my head as I read it.

JJ Burke · Post by **JJ Burke** » Fri Jun 09, 2006 8:15 pm

isn't it described anywhere (important)?

Eidolon · Post by **Eidolon** » Sat Jun 10, 2006 2:48 am

Not in Dagon. He is only described as being HUGE and having arms; oh, and there is a passing reference to Polyphemus the Cyclops... Lovecrafts sure loved him some Cyclopes.

Jesus Prime · Post by **Jesus Prime** » Sat Jun 10, 2006 1:10 pm

Is there not reference to a Deep One the size of a whale in one of the carvings he looks at in "Dagon"?

Eidolon · Post by **Eidolon** » Sat Jun 10, 2006 1:20 pm

Doesn't mention the Deep Ones by name, but we can guess.
"It was the pictorial carving, however, that did most to hold me spellbound.

Plainly visible across the intervening water on account of their enormous size was an array of bas-reliefs whose subjects would have excited the envy of a Dore. I think that these things were supposed to depict men -- at least, a certain sort of men; though the creatures were shown disporting like fishes in the waters of some marine grotto, or paying homage at some monolithic shrine which appeared to be under the waves as well. Of their faces and forms I dare not speak in detail, for the mere remembrance makes me grow faint. Grotesque beyond the imagination of a Poe or a Bulwer, they were damnably human in general outline despite webbed hands and feet, shockingly wide and flabby lips, glassy, bulging eyes, and other features less pleasant to recall. Curiously enough, they seemed to have been chiselled badly out of proportion with their scenic background; for one of the creatures was shown in the act of killing a whale represented as but little larger than himself. I remarked, as I say, their grotesqueness and strange size; but in a moment decided that they were merely the imaginary gods of some primitive fishing or seafaring tribe; some tribe whose last descendant had perished eras before the first ancestor of the Piltdown or Neanderthal Man was born.
Awestruck at this unexpected glimpse into a past beyond the conception of the most daring anthropologist, I stood musing whilst the moon cast queer reflections on the silent channel before me. Then suddenly I saw it. With only a slight churning to mark its rise to the surface, the thing slid into view above the dark waters. Vast, Polyphemus-like, and loathsome, it darted like a stupendous monster of nightmares to the monolith, about which it flung its gigantic scaly arms, the while it bowed its hideous head and gave vent to certain measured sounds. I think I went mad then."

I take this to mean that the thing that slid out of the water was actually just a Deep One, and not Dagon hisself- which would mean that the God proper must be of ridiculous proportions indeed(unsurprising) and that the creatures encountered in 'Innsmouth' are much younger Deep Ones. I mean, why would Dagon worship his own image?

Jesus Prime · Post by **Jesus Prime** » Sat Jun 10, 2006 1:23 pm

It might be reclaiming an idol to itself.

JJ Burke · Post by **JJ Burke** » Sat Jun 10, 2006 2:22 pm

if you tell a police sketch artist 'he had arms, and he was huge, and he reminded me of polyphemus the cyclops in some way that you don't need to know'... what good is that

i think all bets are off, it's a free-for-all of artistic liberty in the depiction of dagon

odin2 · Post by **odin2** » Sat Jun 10, 2006 2:30 pm

I'll have to try that.